New Album "If" (Oct 2021 release)

[Padmachou]

They could surprise us with new songs having the same title as old ones, sure !

I like this one John, but it would need something different in the arrangement to be Libera-like. And we can be sure some boys already know the song it has been recorded by the CVMS Schola Cantorum, of course, as "Requiem Aeternam".

Edit : I keep listening to Vivaldi's "Cum Dederit" and the more I listen to it the more I can picture a Libera arrangement. Something a bit like Sacris Solemnis, voices replacing the cords. It could be amazing.

[filiarheni]

It's good that we now have the CD's release date. While there was no fear over here that they'd postpone it to a year when a Japan tour is possible. It wouldn't make sense to irrevocably link the release to a tour taking place, as unforeseen things can always happen. I guess that they have a corresponding clause in their contract to exclude such a disadvantage for Libera.

And we also have the complete track list, okay, I hope more information is being held back for some more time to have room for speculation and maintaining surprises until the end and I wish they'd tease us! With some nostalgy I remember how we found the song titles of "Hope" step by step and how Libera kept us entertained through the waiting time by throwing out teasers in form of sheet music and lots of snippets, which we tried to assign to the song titles. Do you remember? I wish they would do so again! At least, they didn't reveal the composers yet. And this fact confronts us with a jungle of possibilities for now.

It's striking that a bunch of titles, yes: at first only titles, from the very past can be found. Vespera, Lux Aeterna, Nunc dimittis, Ave Maria, Sacris Solemnis. But while Vespera has already proven to be a new recording and with regard to Ave Maria we can presume that Schubert will now complete the previous Libera Ave Maria trilogy, we have to speculate about Lux Aeterna and Nunc dimittis.
So Robert either explicitly intended to dig out songs from long passed periods, practically as a block. In this case Lux Aeterna and Nunc Dimittis are actually revisits of their old songs.
Or they are not, and that would be very interesting. As part of the liturgy, the Nunc dimittis text was set to music uncountable times. Here is for example a very new setting by Paul Smith / Voces8 . The name "Lux Aeterna" is well-known to us as the vocal version of "Nimrod" from Edward Elgar's Enigma Variations, posted already above.

Apart from all of that, it always remains possible that Robert sat down to compose by himself. For me this is doubtlessly the most desirable option! Even if it may not seem too probable and they just went back to their previous songs.

And I feel exactly that new composition hope for Cum dederit. There only seem to exist the afore-mentioned Vivaldi and a Händel, and I think both are less suitable for a Libera CD. However, Robert might also have actually selected songs dominated by a soloist, such as Ave Maria or If to make rehearsing easier. In that case, Cum dederit could really be Vivaldi or Händel with an added chorus.

I keep listening to Vivaldi's "Cum Dederit" and the more I listen to it the more I can picture a Libera arrangement. Something a bit like Sacris Solemnis, voices replacing the cords. It could be amazing.

It does have a mystic touch. Anyway, I'd prefer the thought of a new composition.

The pandemic placed Libera into a long exceptional state: messed up the rehearsal routine, reduced the concerts to an absolute minimum, no tours to be prepared. And this in turn makes it conceivable that Robert used some of the gained time to compose. I'd love it. I really find that it's time for many new songs, like on "Hope". "Beyond", in contrast, had too many revisits and had me suspect that simply for fulfilling a contract they went back to so many older songs.

Home. Well. Filling material? That is 1: 1 repetition like Mother of God on "Beyond"? Or more like Salve Regina and Benedictus Deus from "Hope" to "Beyond", so more or less the same arrangement or even a takeover with only a new soloist?

With Once an Angel I don't get any further. Neil Young doesn't fit, as others already pointed out. So I rely on this being a new composition.

Obviously, I must come to the conclusion that a title alone doesn't mean anything. Let's recall Salve Regina. Who would have thought during our "Hope" speculations that it would be a song based on a famous classical piece again? Btw, this could also be the case with Cum dederit. We can count on everything and nothing.

I am eagerly waiting for If and am excited for a wonderful solo by Daniel. The song is very impressive, only I wasn't fully convinced by Daniel's solo at the concert. His voice was not flowing as freely as usual, which was certainly due to the fact that with this song a huge load weighs on the soloist: Such an extended, song-dominating solo for such a serious and poignant song, performed for the first time, that's an enormous task! So I'm all the more looking forward to the recording, where he surely was relaxed.

Vespera, how exciting that is! First the new recording with Aled Jones and then including it on their new album, that's a strong hint that this song is finally getting prepared for its appearance in concert! Our todo? Prepare how to fill the time when crying for Vespera is history.

Ok, if we group it:

a) New, but possibly no new compositions, at least unclear
Once an angel
Cum dederit
O Lord, support us

b) Unclear whether new or old
Nunc dimittis
Lux aeterna

c) New in the last concert
Let me make songs
If
Sing

d) Not yet on CD, but sung in concerts
Total Praise
Nearer My God

e) Alt
Ave Maria
Vespera
Sacris solemnis
Deep Peace
Home

The record label announced "five brandnew songs". Assuming that Let me make songs, If and Sing are brand new in this sense, which are the other two?

Once an Angel?
Cum dederit?

O Lord support us
No idea about this one! Found several versions with this title on YouTube but that gives us no defining hints.

Rather excluding hints, maybe.

O Lord Support Us: However, the one by Gary Davison seems like a good candidate. It's the only one that seemed to be written for a treble choir.

Here are a few settings of "O Lord, support us":

www.youtube.com/watch?v=J0mubkYli8M (David Briggs)
www.youtube.com/watch?v=mA772zqzUoQ (Bob Chilcott)
www.youtube.com/watch?v=UkfpDBWib2Y (Gary Davidson)
www.youtube.com/watch?v=4RWcYumP4HE (Allen Pote)

The Pote setting to me sounds like a Libera arrangement can be created. The Gary Davison one is calm and nice, but somehow doesn't seem to lead anywhere in terms of typical Libera arrangements, whereas I'm able to picture a grand dynamical development in Pote with a fine lead solo and interweaving choral voices. Again: It's solely speculation and perhaps we actually get a new, fresh composition?

I am hoping for some solos by Freddie and Neo. Daniel is safe, and we can probably also count on Dominik, Luca, Victor, in case the voice change didn't strike too early. Oliver WR? However, I would love to have a couple of new soloists, especially since you never know to what extent the boys are given a chance in time. This is something the pandemic has taught. So such a chance should be used as soon as it opens.

As for the album cover: We know that If will come with a video and saw some photos by Libera where they find themselves in a gloomy environment. The title song If deals with a wishful situation, which has not become truth yet, so it rather expresses being caught in darkness as of now, but feeling a ray of hope in all of that darkness. I find that an ideal relation between song lyrics, song video and album cover.

[Padmachou]

Wow, you have been working a lot Thanks for sharing these analysis !

I am hoping for some solos by Freddie and Neo. Daniel is safe, and we can probably also count on Dominik, Luca, Victor, in case the voice change didn't strike too early. Oliver WR? However, I would love to have a couple of new soloists, especially since you never know to what extent the boys are given a chance in time. This is something the pandemic has taught. So such a chance should be used as soon as it opens.

Difficult to guess the soloists, apart from Daniel singing "If", which seems secure for too reasons : we have reasons to suspect it has been recorded a while ago, and to think Daniel's voice hasn't broken. We do not know when the recording took place, before, after, during the crisis ? a bit of before AND after ? and maybe in the middle too ? Well, some boys' voices have broken now, like Neo, I suspect Oliver WR too, and I couldn't help but notice that Victor was missing from a certain treble's recital from a certain choir recently... But they might have recorded solos before. Someone pointed out that maybe "Ave Maria" is a record of the covid-concert with Tadgh, if recorded soon enough ? Though I agree a Shubert's Ave Maria would make sense.

I guess we will be surprised with both new and old soloists, but the surprise will also be for the next concert. There is high probability that for some songs, we never hear live the same soloists as the record. I am unsure but did Alex Montoro actually sing "From a Distance" live, for example ? I only remember hearing Merlin (but I never attended concert outside Europe).
It sure will be exciting, I can't wait to find out. I spare a thought for the "old newbies" like Daniel C, Cameron, Ludwig, Morgan, who have been part of Libera for a while now, but we do not know so well. They might be soloists too, right ? It would be nice to be surprised with a name we do no expect at all.

Oh, I just listened to the songs you linked. I really like the Allen Pote one, you are right.

[filiarheni]

We do not know when the recording took place, before, after, during the crisis ? a bit of before AND after ? and maybe in the middle too ? Well, some boys' voices have broken now, like Neo, I suspect Oliver WR too, and I couldn't help but notice that Victor was missing from a certain treble's recital from a certain choir recently... But they might have recorded solos before.

Didn't they say somewhere that they were doing recordings during October last year? I can't find it anymore, where was that? Creative World?

Someone pointed out that maybe "Ave Maria" is a record of the covid-concert with Tadgh, if recorded soon enough ? Though I agree a Shubert's Ave Maria would make sense.

Yes, perhaps the version with Tadhg will land on the album.

As for the album cover: We know that If will come with a video and saw some photos by Libera where they find themselves in a gloomy environment. The title song If deals with a wishful situation, which has not become truth yet, so it rather expresses being caught in darkness as of now, but feeling a ray of hope in all of that darkness. I find that an ideal relation between song lyrics, song video and album cover.

In addition to this, I recall Libera's photos of a filming day, and this must be "If".
www.instagram.com/p/CH0UAA_sZUI/?igshid=gtpbrhf69br9

This follows the trajectory of their major, non-Christmas album covers in which they are journeying first across a sea, then mountains and valleys, and finally are arriving at the entrance to something....something we do not know!

Apart from the metaphor that life is an ocean and also of crossing a water to the beyond, the journey across a wild, stormy sea in hope for a better future has a pretty concrete meaning in our times ... On the "Beyond" cover there's that high mountain that either has to be overcome at last or points to heaven as aim and origin, as the mountain is formed like an arrow. The big darkness on the third album doesn't really fit to the others and I think that here the effect of the pandemic manifests. The link to the others is more noticeable by the style and the 3 boys.
The number of 3 is very symbolic too of course.

So far we have the album cover which continues the theme of the Libera boys

And if we set the album titles of that series in chronological order, we get "Hope Beyond If". Even if it was a coincidence, it still makes perfect sense for me: As dreary as life may be and as many severe storms we have to face in this world with hardly seeing a way out (no windows in that big room on the cover!), the doubts can confidently be silenced.

[bachmahlerfan]

O Lord support us
No idea about this one! Found several versions with this title on YouTube but that gives us no defining hints.

Rather excluding hints, maybe.

O Lord Support Us: However, the one by Gary Davison seems like a good candidate. It's the only one that seemed to be written for a treble choir.

Here are a few settings of "O Lord, support us":

www.youtube.com/watch?v=J0mubkYli8M (David Briggs)
www.youtube.com/watch?v=mA772zqzUoQ (Bob Chilcott)
www.youtube.com/watch?v=UkfpDBWib2Y (Gary Davidson)
www.youtube.com/watch?v=4RWcYumP4HE (Allen Pote)

The Pote setting to me sounds like a Libera arrangement can be created. The Gary Davison one is calm and nice, but somehow doesn't seem to lead anywhere in terms of typical Libera arrangements, whereas I'm able to picture a grand dynamical development in Pote with a fine lead solo and interweaving choral voices. Again: It's solely speculation and perhaps we actually get a new, fresh composition?

I have to admit I hadn't heard the Pote until you mentioned it, but I just don't see the potential in it as a Libera arrangement. So, I'm still leaning towards the Davison setting because it seems to be performed with some frequency in England, unlike the Pote setting. Additionally, it seems like the Pote setting is seldom performed anywhere, while a couple of his other compositions have numerous appearances on Youtube. So, I think it's less likely that Robert is familiar with it. To be honest, the Davison setting doesn't excite me much either, but I would still prefer it over the other setting. Anyways, I'm rooting for a new composition on this track. By the way, the Wells Cathedral performance of the Davison is a lot better than the one you linked.

[Surpinto]

Wonderful analysis and input as always, filiarheni!

It's good that we now have the CD's release date. While there was no fear over here that they'd postpone it to a year when a Japan tour is possible. It wouldn't make sense to irrevocably link the release to a tour taking place, as unforeseen things can always happen. I guess that they have a corresponding clause in their contract to exclude such a disadvantage for Libera.

Or perhaps they added an addendum (formally or informally) due to COVID. That is usually the case in an amicable relationship. Of course it is likely that many of the things done between two parties are informal arrangement. I say that because I am the one always speculating about the exact business arrangement between Libera Records and Libera but recently this thought occurred to me.

And we also have the complete track list, okay, I hope more information is being held back for some more time to have room for speculation and maintaining surprises until the end and I wish they'd tease us! With some nostalgy I remember how we found the song titles of "Hope" step by step and how Libera kept us entertained through the waiting time by throwing out teasers in form of sheet music and lots of snippets, which we tried to assign to the song titles. Do you remember? I wish they would do so again! At least, they didn't reveal the composers yet. And this fact confronts us with a jungle of possibilities for now.

YES! Teasers PLEASE!

So Robert either explicitly intended to dig out songs from long passed periods, practically as a block. In this case Lux Aeterna and Nunc Dimittis are actually revisits of their old songs.
Or they are not, and that would be very interesting.

A lot of Angel Voices and older Libera songs have been resurrected over the years which is why I think it highly unlikely that an alternate setting of the Nunc Dimittis would be used. I could certainly be wrong but this has been their pattern for decades now with songs! My speculation on the soloist for that would actually be either Victor or Dominik; though Victor usually tends to sing in a slightly lower range.

And I feel exactly that new composition hope for Cum dederit. There only seem to exist the afore-mentioned Vivaldi and a Händel, and I think both are less suitable for a Libera CD. However, Robert might also have actually selected songs dominated by a soloist, such as Ave Maria or If to make rehearsing easier. In that case, Cum dederit could really be Vivaldi or Händel with an added chorus.

Too much coloratura on the Handel I think!

I keep listening to Vivaldi's "Cum Dederit" and the more I listen to it the more I can picture a Libera arrangement. Something a bit like Sacris Solemnis, voices replacing the cords. It could be amazing.

It does have a mystic touch. Anyway, I'd prefer the thought of a new composition.

I agree with Padma on this as the composition is not so far removed from being arranged for them. Although we cannot know for certain.

I am eagerly waiting for If and am excited for a wonderful solo by Daniel. The song is very impressive, only I wasn't fully convinced by Daniel's solo at the concert. His voice was not flowing as freely as usual, which was certainly due to the fact that with this song a huge load weighs on the soloist: Such an extended, song-dominating solo for such a serious and poignant song, performed for the first time, that's an enormous task! So I'm all the more looking forward to the recording, where he surely was relaxed.

I think he sounded perfectly fine in concert. Obviously a studio recording will be even better where, as you well state, everyone is relaxed and the audio capture quality is higher with the ability to redo any mistakes or problems. But the song itself, the lyrics, and his very expressive singing were highly emotionally resonant with me. The song really touches the heart.

The record label announced "five brandnew songs". Assuming that Let me make songs, If and Sing are brand new in this sense, which are the other two?

Once an Angel?
Cum dederit?

Good point. Perhaps some of the songs are renamed or rearrangements of old songs? Because where is "Lord Support Us" in this? Unless the figure of five is wrong here.

As for the album cover: We know that If will come with a video and saw some photos by Libera where they find themselves in a gloomy environment. The title song If deals with a wishful situation, which has not become truth yet, so it rather expresses being caught in darkness as of now, but feeling a ray of hope in all of that darkness. I find that an ideal relation between song lyrics, song video and album cover.

I agree! Everyone seems focused on the dark background but it the light shining through the doorway where our focus, thematically with the album, ought to be.

[filiarheni]

And I feel exactly that new composition hope for Cum dederit. There only seem to exist the afore-mentioned Vivaldi and a Händel, and I think both are less suitable for a Libera CD. However, Robert might also have actually selected songs dominated by a soloist, such as Ave Maria or If to make rehearsing easier. In that case, Cum dederit could really be Vivaldi or Händel with an added chorus.

Too much coloratura on the Handel I think!

There's no coloratura here.

Can't help it, but in case it is in fact one of these two, I'm more inclined to the Händel. I consider the Vivaldi as highly difficult, as it has a number of extremely long notes, so the soloist needs an exceptionally good breath to hold them and to fill them with life. In this regard the Händel is much less demanding and it is very short. It would be doable (thinking of Dominik ... ). Robert visited Händel already earlier for Where'er you walk (which doesn't have to be a reason of course).

The record label announced "five brandnew songs". Assuming that Let me make songs, If and Sing are brand new in this sense, which are the other two?

Once an Angel?
Cum dederit?

Good point. Perhaps some of the songs are renamed or rearrangements of old songs? Because where is "Lord Support Us" in this? Unless the figure of five is wrong here.

All of this can be the case. As long as we have no definition for "brandnew", the speculation finds no end ...

[filiarheni]

I must still add some more about the covemr I'm afraid. Writing at Libera-Welt yesterday made me aware that the German word "aussichtslos" is perfectly illustrated by the scene. "Aussichtslos" literally means "viewless", but while the German "Aussicht" alone can be used for the "view" and for "hope, prospect", we never actually use "aussichtslos" literally, but exclusively figuratively: to describe a completely hopeless situation or condition. The lacking windows on the cover mean, literally taken, no view nor light (= methaphor for hope, joy, "in-sight"). It's "aussichtslos", this time meaning both. ​
Not sure how it works in other languages. Anyway, I like how this falls into place.

[dani]

Home was on Hope and is still yet to be performed live so I would hope that means it’s going to get a live performance considering it’s been on a very recent album.


Ave Maria it’s not my favorite version but Tadhg deserves this so I am pleased for him ( assuming we are correct and it’s his version).


I am most pleased about Vespera as me and Yorkie have been pleading for years to get this remade and on a set list. I hope it’s Luca on the solo.

[j8000]

Cum dederit is a phrase from the middle section of psalm 127, and this psalm has numerous settings to music in Latin typically titled Nisi Dominus after the first two words. With the settings by Vivaldi and Handel the Cum dederit section is a separate movement, but it occurs in all the Latin settings of Nisi dominus by other composers from Arrigoni to Victoria (e.g. here in Monterverdi's 1610 Vespers: youtu.be/YO6kkBV9fSc?t=101). Obviously many of these wouldn't work as the basis for a standalone song, but maybe some would. This is when I go and listen to them all to find out, but of course it most likely is the Vivaldi or Handel.

[Surpinto]

Cum dederit is a phrase from the middle section of psalm 127, and this psalm has numerous settings to music in Latin typically titled Nisi Dominus after the first two words. With the settings by Vivaldi and Handel the Cum dederit section is a separate movement, but it occurs in all the Latin settings of Nisi dominus by other composers from Arrigoni to Victoria (e.g. here in Monterverdi's 1610 Vespers: youtu.be/YO6kkBV9fSc?t=101). Obviously many of these wouldn't work as the basis for a standalone song, but maybe some would. This is when I go and listen to them all to find out, but of course it most likely is the Vivaldi or Handel.

But actually this shows it could be a new composition and not necessarily an arrangement of an extant piece.

[j8000]

But actually this shows it could be a new composition and not necessarily an arrangement of an extant piece.

Indeed that could be the case, although perhaps it is an unusual fragment on which to compose a new piece in isolation, occurring as it does half way through a verse.

[GlennJalmas]

A recent tweet from Libera Moose.

[dani]

I am glad they are recording some of the recording seasons as well.


It’s a time in history we won’t forget and for the boys a singing experience like no other. So it will be intriguing to see how much work has gone into getting this album done.

[Surpinto]

We now have the back of the album which contains more information. There are other photos as well available at Amazon -- just click the album art to access them.

It seems we were correct about the Vivaldi, the Ave Maria, and the Nunc Dimittis. I'm honestly surprised that the reference there is to a TV series which ran from 1979 until 1980; rather than to simply refer to it as the Geoffrey Burgon version.